011 Celia Meisel shares her journey of moving everything into Notion while using colored emojis for visual management. This includes managing her outreach for speaking gigs. She also reveals how she conducted an in-depth 365-day time study to fully optimize her system and establish an accurate model of her capabilities. This enabled her to set up high-level structures in Notion to optimize her project work time.
Celia Faye Meisel is a Strategic Sales Growth Consultant. She is a career entrepreneur with over 20 years of experience as a Trainer, Mentor, and Coach.
Her 5-step “More Method” helps her clients to have More Money, More Sales with Ease, More Simplicity, More Sales Freedom, and More Growth in their businesses.
The sales initiatives Celia has trained sales teams for, led, and sold for have generated over $11.2 Million in high-ticket program sales.
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Detailed Show Notes With Transcript: https://chrisnixon.com/episode-11/
GUEST LINKS For: Sabine Kvenberg
Website 1: https://www.celiafayemeisel.com
Website 2: https://www.fixmysalesproblems.com
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CeliaFayeMeisel
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/celiafaye.meisel/
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/celia-faye-meisel/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdX1zvURsdPCbDDKUjtzc4w
Linktree: https://solo.to/celiafayemeisel
Tools and Books mentioned in this episode:
- Notion: https://www.notion.so/
- ClickUp: https://clickup.com/
- Asana: https://asana.com/
- Trello: https://trello.com/en
- Basecamp: https://basecamp.com/
- Mead (AT-A-GLANCE): https://www.mead.com/
- Observer Effect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect
LINKS
Website: https://chrisnixon.com
Blog: https://chrisnixon.com/blog
Podcast: https://chrisnixon.com/podcast
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**This episode Copyright © 2023 Chris Nixon***
Music: spacedust by airtone (c) copyright 2022 Licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution (3.0) license. http://dig.ccmixter.org/files/airtone/64741
Transcript
Chris
So I invite you to share your name and the field of work that you do.
Celia
HI am Celia Faye Meisel and I say that I do systems sales and strategy and I work with CEO’s that are earning 6 figures in their business to streamline their processes. Most importantly, their sales process so they can have greater prosperity in their business and a life that.
Chris
Right. So if we define a goal planning system as a set of all of the tools essentially that you use day-to-day in order to achieve your goals, how does your goal planning system play a part in your life and the work? That you shared.
Celia
My goodness, it plays a huge role in my life. You know, first of all, like you had mentioned before we started this. Show that our goals are, you know, it’s a vision that we have for our business. It’s a vision that we have set for ourselves and then we kind of break down all the tasks and what’s needed. To achieve that goal. And so I I’m a person that needs a lot of structure and a lot of systemization to be productive just because I’m a very creative thinker. And so with my. Goal planning and setting system. I would say it’s at the pinnacle and the core of my life for everything from. How I operate my business to UM back country cramping trips that I do with my husband. Do you know meal planning? I mean, so it’s just really at the core of the hub of my life. And I would say that I spend a good majority of my hours in a week, you know, of revolving around my coat planning system in some way.
Chris
So I think it to be effective. It really needs to be holistic, doesn’t it? We used to talk about the work life balance and separating work from home life and all that.
Celia
It does.
Chris
But I think we’re changing a little bit in that regard and realizing that you know what we really need to look at. Everything as a whole, because really what we do for work is part of our life and what we do at home also affects our work more now than ever. So I love that you’ve taken this holistic approach to it. So, so how did you come to realize that you really needed a? System in place.
Celia
I would say that it started. The summer of 2019. I mean, I had completely booked out my one-on-one coaching. I was at a maximum capacity in my practice and I didn’t I had my offer delivery and I had that system worked out, but the back end of tracking the number of calls used and where clients were in their progress. And all of that, and also being able to handle the volume of of clients in terms of like when they came into my business. And umm, how I how I guided them through a process. I would say that that was the first time in my life that I really looked at it and said, OK, I’m really growing and I need something that’s gonna help me maintain and sustain. And so it definitely started with my with my business 1st and then began to trickle over into my life. As well, but definitely being really busy booked out, having a full plate, it caused me to start asking different questions about things and that’s where I started to learn about SO’s and processes and systems. And went down that rabbit. Hole and never looked back.
Chris
So obviously, if you were already in business, you had been achieving and you had, uh, you know, set set some goals for yourself. So how were you managing it before then to get to that point?
Celia
So I always knew that I had income goals. I had things that I was working toward. So at that time it was more, you know, because we’re talking about the business. So it had been like. I have a sales goal that I want to make or an income goal that I want to make. These are the packages that I want to sell. These are the clients that I want to work with, so I would breakdown sort of all of the staff. This is the marketing that I need to do. So at the time I was doing a lot of networking and so I would say we’re going to like give a nugget. To the listeners, it would be kind of zooming out and looking for the patterns and the trends and all of the big milestones that go into the process to being able to achieve the goals. So I kind of broke down like the client, the offer, the sales. Goal the marketing all of that and then also making sure that I was, uh, you know, allowing plenty of time for that at the time I it was more intuitive and instinctual. I didn’t have like a structured process for it. Hence why when the business got booked out. It was like, Oh my gosh, can’t you know a little bit of excitement, but chaos too, because, like, how do I handle this? Because I reached that point where I couldn’t really weigh it anymore, I needed to have more structure in place.
Chris
And I and I think the same thing can happen even outside of business. I mean, families change we you know we like go from. From being a single person to being maybe being married, maybe bringing kids into the mix, and now we’ve got, you know, preschool and soccer and all those things to deal with. So all of a sudden our life changes and and we get to a stage in our life where we realize that what we’re doing is just not quite enough adequate to keep the overwhelming Bay isn’t.
Celia
It 100%.
Chris
And same thing when you when you start a business and. You know that one of the scary things about business is to not have any clients and then even more scary sometimes is to have a whole bunch of clients. Now, what do you do with them, right?
Celia
Exactly, and in fulfillment. Being able to fulfill on what you promised.
Chris
So can you share some of the nuts and bolts then about how you now manage these things with with your business?
Celia
So I think it would be great to give some context more because more just kind of diving into the journey. So I would say I think it was, it was summer of 2021. I went on this journey of I wanted to. I had, I was using Google Docs and Google Drive and I wanted to organize my back end. The Google Drive, because it was just all over the place and you know, documents here documents. There and I had become more of an organized person, but just things were everywhere. So I started researching different softwares and tools. You click up. Umm I had used a sauna I had. Used a little bit of Trello. Basecamp, right. So I started kind of going into the softwares and exploring and ended up getting into. A program that was click up based and it was like how to run your business with click up and I had used click up before with a team member and we had kind of develop. Like repeat tasks and automations for marketing and so we had created gotten things to be pretty systemized, but with what I was learning and click up in Google Docs, it didn’t really all integrate together. Like I still. Needed multiple tools. And that led me into discovering notion and. When I found notion I had heard about it before, and then I was like, oh, I don’t know. You know, I I because I really needed like a trainer that could kind of help me with the strategy as well. Umm so then I got back into notion and started exploring it again this past December. So right at the end of 2021. And once I got into it, I was hooked. So now everything is. I run through notion I barely use Google Docs or Google Drive anymore. It’s usually like if I’m working with a team or a client that uses them, so I manage everything inside of notion, both for my personal life and for my business life and the way that I do that. Is I set my goals, my bigger picture goals. So for example like I have speaking goals right? So like I’m on this podcast with you right now, that’s what I’m that’s been one of my. Initiatives of 2022. So I have my sales goals. I have my ongoing tasks and projects that I’m working on with my team. I also have like I mentioned, the personal side where I go Backcountry camping and exploring nature with my husband. I have goals related to that around my packing list and food and things like that so. I’m able to manage. Everything inside of notion in one hub. And sit down. And then I what I’ve done is I’ve built systems around those specific goals, so I’ll pause there because I know that with a lot and you can ask me more questions or clarify.
Chris
Well, would you like to just dive a little bit deeper then let’s let’s, let’s walk the journey. So you you think you think of a of an idea which might become a goal. So how do you manage that in notion?
Celia
Yes, yes. OK. So let’s let’s take one that I’ve already done. So let’s say like for the speaking, so. Notion has this amazing way. It’s really a database system, so a lot of people get overwhelmed with notion because it’s incredibly customizable. And then there’s the geek out. People like me who are like, yes, it’s customizable. So you kind of have the two different camps. So for example, for the speaking, the first thing that I did was I created a database and it was like. List right? So almost like you can envision like a Google Google sheet where I have a list and then I have different columns, OK and then what I would do is I would track all of the applications for speaking that I put in for podcasts for summit, anything.
Chris
OK.
Celia
And then I. Track and then I added, uh, you can add emojis. And so I added an emoji system, so like red was. It’s a no, not a fit green was. It’s a go. You know, the date is scheduled. Yellow is. I’ve got a verbal yes, but we haven’t. We haven’t set a date yet and then I will. Have like a. Check box when. I’ll add the check mark like when everything is done.
Chris
So just just sorry to interrupt, but just to clarify then the goal was to book a certain number of speaking engagements.
Celia
Then it. Yep, Yep. So it was speaking engagements. So I didn’t set. I didn’t set a number. Like I think I had. I had said that I wanted to do maybe 50 in the next 12 months or something like that, but it was definitely, yeah, that the goal was to book speaking guests, get engagement specifically on podcasts and submit.
Chris
OK, got it. OK, so now you’re effectively tracking them and being able to measure essentially your progress. Working through that, yes, OK, yes. So now, so, so now you’re tracking it. So let’s go one level deeper. Obviously there needs to be some actions in order to create those rows in notion, right. So how do you manage that?
Celia
So I would, I would put like my application date. Uh, if once the date was scheduled like once the interview was scheduled, I would track that. That and then you can also add statuses. You can make custom columns of of custom statuses, so I would also add the status and then there’s a notes area where I can put notes. So essentially I would say that I was managing it kind of like a. CR M where I’m coming in. I’m checking in and then I get. So maybe two or three times a week. I would go in and then I would go and check. You know where things were and then see if I needed to to follow up like I know with you. I think I reached back out to you like two or three or maybe two or. Three times, like why? Are we? Are we still on? So that’s how I you know that’s how I manage that. But umm, so it helps me to, you know, build a relationship with the people that I’m collaborating with. It also just helps me to follow through. So I’m not because to to apply for several speaking gigs. I think I tracked that like in one week. I might have put in eight hours into going into Facebook groups, submitting the applications, setting up the. The row and notion you know, there was a whole, there was a whole process to that. And so if I’m putting in that time in the front end, there needs to be some follow up and. Follow through on the back end as well.
Chris
So you get up in the morning, you do your thing, you decide you’re going to do some business stuff. You open up notion and. You have a look at this sheet is a sheet. You call it a sheet in notion.
Celia
They’re so you have pages?
Chris
OK. So you have a look at the page and. You just scan. It for what are you looking for?
Celia
So I would go. So I have my color coding system, so I would usually go to the yellow. So I said I have my emojis. It’s so it’s like green. We’re, we’re, we’re set, we’re done. And so I would usually go. To the yellows, those are the those are.
Chris
OK so. Visual management here.
Celia
The ones that are, yeah.
Chris
Then you’re looking at the yellow stuff. OK, good.
Celia
Yes, good question.
Chris
So that yellow jumps out at you and then.
Celia
Yeah, and then I’ll click in and I’ll I’ll check in. I’ll I’ll click on each of the individual entries and read through them and then I’ll go and do a follow up message or I’ll do an outreach. Or I’ll look in and say, you know, I applied, you know, however many weeks or months ago, this hasn’t moved forward. And I can also decide if I just want to move it down into the no category as well. If if something is stalled out so it kind of it just helps keep things moving.
Chris
Brilliant. Love it.
Celia
Thank you.
Chris
So what other systems have you tried then before you arrived at?
Celia
So definitely I click up with. One UM. Which is, which is great. It’s a great tool to use. I used Google Drive. I would say that I. Was very, very. Heavy with Google Drive like I was trying to do everything in Google Drive and then prior to that it had been years. I had used a sauna and base camp. And but more recently. It was heavily like click up and Google Drive were the two tools that I was using.
Chris
So I’ve set up a base camp. I’ve set up a sauna. I’ve set up Google Systems before. I haven’t worked in notion yet, so tell me what? What does notion have for you that these others didn’t provide?
Celia
Yes, I would say the first thing was click up was more of a task management. So it was more like here’s my information. Here are my tasks and it had all of these layers where you could continue to go deeper and deeper and deeper with subtasks and at some point. Paint the system would break or it would just kind of get ineffective. Uh, in terms of, you know, not being able to do repeatable task or I would say the a great word to use a siloed, you could just get a little too siloed. And I found the same thing with Google Drive where like intermingling folders and. Docs you know the hierarchy is set that folders are always at the top and docs are always at the bottom. And so that limits your your customization in terms of like folder organization, document organization. I tried doing like an org chart model where I built it out with like functions of the business in Google Drive. I tried doing like my my mentor she used to call it the Dewey Decimal system. But I tried doing like number systems like 1.1 point one and one point 1.2 you know I tried doing that as well and it just the system wasn’t customizable enough and same with clickup. It was very. He it was very UM, you know, you could customize, but to a point where his notion has so many different options of how you could set things up, use databases, pages, how you organize things. So just the customization level of being able to take everything from Google Drive and move it into notion everything from click up. And move it into notion. Kind of took away that silloin problem that I was having.
Chris
Right. And I just want to be clear that I think all of these tools are wonderful tools and it it the combination of what specifically you want the tool to do and your work. Style it dictates what works well for you.
Celia
Yes, 100%. I know I mean I lived and breathed Google Drive and loved it and still love it and appreciate it and click up too. And for me, I and I have just, uh, become such a fan of notion that it’s like to me it’s like the Holy Grail of of softwares. So I think very highly of it, especially as how it’s helped me so much. To move things forward.
Chris
So shifting gears a little bit, some of my guests have shared that their very first planner came in high school. I’m curious, did you have a planner in high school? Did they end do? You have paper planner or agenda.
Celia
Yes, yes, I’m trying to remember when I got my first. I mean, I would say that, I mean, it goes even back. I mean I would consider like my journal and my Diaries when I was a little kid, you know, I wasn’t like breaking down and setting tasks. But like, really, that’s when I first started like. Setting my goals and my intentions when I was really young, uh, but definitely I had a planner in high school. I don’t. I don’t remember much I. I just feel like I just. Kind of showed up and was told where to go all the time it was in. I think it was more so in college that I really got more into planning and the color coding and the highlighting and then it definitely when I started my first business in 2008, I had a big I had a lot of clients to manage. I got more into the, so I would say. As I got. Older and more, you know, into business the demand for a planner you know became. More of a reality.
Chris
I’m curious, when you were really young, started starting to journal, who influenced you to to do that? Do you recall?
Celia
I think it was just natural. It was very expressive and you know, maybe I read a book where a girl had a diary or I saw a show and you know, and then like, I got, you know, you got your first diary when you were, you know, when you were little. Colin, I think it was more probably like, you know, societal influence than than a specific person. And my mom used to always buy me little notebooks and journals too. So I think that she and she was kind of a note taker and ideas. So I think that she influenced me in that regard.
Chris
Right. So some of it rubbed off from there. That’s pretty. So when you were in college, you said you started using a a planner of sorts. Do you recall what type of planner it was?
Celia
I feel like it was like the Mead at a glance, so. It would have been the. Uh, the calendar, like the, so it would have been like the calendar days of the month picture grid. And then maybe with notes on the side.
Chris
Then why not stick with that now?
Celia
Well, I went digital. I went digital with my calendar and my plant because it was more. But I would say it was more of a scheduler and, you know, planning scheduling is where I need to be. When, UM, I started going digital with that around 2012 with the iCal.
Chris
Yeah, yeah.
Celia
And then had a major breakdown where like I lost all of my calendar entries. So I think I went back to paper for a while and then eventually found my way to Google Calendar. Though I know people now that they have online businesses and they have to have their paper planner still, so they may put it in the Google in a Google Cal or I Cal, but they it still always goes in the paper. Calendar because they just don’t trust the online calendar. But for me I just needed to digitize. And make it just make it a little bit more easy, especially for recurring appointments and meetings.
Chris
So you’re still using Google Calendar. Yes, mind sharing a little bit about that. How do you use it?
Celia
Oh, I love. Yeah, I love Google Calendar and I’ve tried so many different things in in terms of because you can set up so many different calendars. So I have my main I try to really operate with one main calendar now instead of like the silos of the of the different ones, just because if I ever work with the team then I need to share my calendar. I’m not having to share 8 calendars with them, so I have my primary calendar that I use and then I so I schedule my meetings, things like that and so. I would say there’s a level up beyond the Google Calendar where in my notion I set a plan for how I’m going to run my schedule. So I set my, I made a a plan for my fall schedule so that is that Mondays and Wednesdays are like my appointments and meetings days. Tuesdays, Thursdays are my kind of creative flow days where I’ll work on project behind the scenes work and then Fridays are sort of optional. If I want to work on family stuff, I could do sales calls. I could do meetings, they can kind of rotate depending on on the need, and so then. That plan of my, I would say that’s like my my time management or my time planning system then influences how I use my Google Calendar in terms of when I schedule things and when I don’t schedule things. But I don’t use it to like block out or schedule like I’m going to work on a project from. You know from one to three I tended like to be more in the creative flow with like when I work on things.
Chris
So then the Google Calendar would really have meetings where it definitely time sensitive. And you talked about in notion you’ve got your, your work plan and it sounds like you you’re kind of blocking out themes to work on on different days and different times. So that doesn’t end up in Google Calendar, OK.
Celia
Nope, it I don’t put it in Google Calendar because otherwise it just gets too crowded. So I have it. I have it for reference. And then it might. It’ll translate over. To like when I’m working with my team and I’m having them update my calendar. For the fall. They know these are the days. These are the times that I’m available for appointments, but doing the blocking on the Google Calendar it just becomes like a little cluttered for me. That’s it.
I could set up a calendar for my team reference or we could. We could do that. If I needed to have a visual for someone. UM and it could also be set up a notion if I needed to as well, so I do have options, but at this point it’s not like in that visual space of having it in the Google Calendar.
Chris
So tell me about the themes then that you’ve created in, in notion around blocking out your time. And is that the, is that the right term for you blocking your time or what do you call that?
Celia
So in notion I called it my weekly schedule outline and then what I did was I first I set a goal for the number of hours I wanted to work per week. So I decided I want to work 20 to 25 hours. A week and. Roughly Monday through Thursday, so that was like, that was my goal, 11 to 4 or 12 to 5. So that’s about 20 hours a week that I set the goal and then I decided these are then I’ll set my themes for the specific days because I find that if I’m it’s, it’s better for me to get into a flow state. Or I’m doing like all of one thing. I don’t really do well if I’m on zoom and then I’m working on something that I’m on zoom, it’s better to just. Do all the zoom meetings. As much you know it on the same day as possible and then have my other days where I can. Work on my projects.
Chris
The cost of switching back and forth takes a lot of energy and a. Lot of thought.
Celia
It does.
Chris
Sometimes I think we don’t realize how much. So, so you’ve got these. The outline of the outline now why not?
Celia
Yes, yes.
Chris
Go down to a finer grain and actually put the specific projects you’re working on in that time. Why are you staying at that?
Celia
That’s a good question. Well, so the so where I manage my projects, I have a project management area. And I have like a kind of that would be like my project management tools. And so it’s in that area that I break down all of my. Me all of my project and the reason that I don’t schedule them in is because number one, I think it’s for like the creative flow like because sometimes I maybe I just want to get up, I like to have choices.
Chris
Right.
Celia
And while I love structure and I love the structure, I don’t also I don’t like. To be boxed in. Like I have to do this at this time because sometimes I might wake up. UMI have an autoimmune condition that I manage and so sometimes I just might be a little slower getting going in the mornings and I just need a little extra time to get ready and so keeping it open, keeping the calendar open and spacious kind of gives me that freedom to. Take care of myself and not feel guilty that I’m constantly moving things. But I’ve tried to like plan and block and have everything scheduled and it just it’s too constrictive for me.
Chris
Yes, I definitely think that that’s a healthy way to operate and for a lot of the reasons you shared, if you start trying to schedule specific times for for lots of smaller type tasks, the feedback mechanism is failure when you don’t get them done necessarily. And whereas if you are able to create these themes, if you will and you can walk into that hour or 4 hour block whatever it is, tuning out everything that’s not quite related to that theme and you can really turn your creativity on and just think about that stuff and and create and be creative. Right.
Celia
Right.
Chris
Whereas if we’re, if we’re, if our calendar is full of all kinds of different things, we’re we’re thinking of all kinds of different things and it’s really hard to just relax. And really, you know, put our best selves forward.
Celia
Yes, yes. And I think too for me just in reflecting on the question, I’m not operating from memory and when I go into those days, I’m not winging it in terms of, oh, what are we going to work on today? There were definitely years ago where I would. I think this is probably why I got my system set up in the 1st place that I would open the laptop. And it would just stare at me and. I might open my e-mail and go to Facebook and be like what are we do now? You know, there was just no structure into what I was working on. UM and. And so like what we’ve talked about today like. You know, talking about, like, my goal of speaking and tracking that I have my CRM and my notion and I have my, I have a Kanban flow of, you know, where people are in the deal cycle. I have a project management page where I track all of the projects that we’re working on with our team, so there’s really maybe like. Three or four areas that I’m going to a notion that already have everything that I’m working on, document it out. So all I have to do is just pick it up and then work on the next step of whatever that is. And if I have an area where. I’m stuck or? I have a bottleneck. Then I know that I might need to go get coaching. Or get help or decide to just. Put the project on hold for the time being. So I think because I’m not operating from memory or just just kind of deciding for the moment like what’s going to happen on those Tuesdays and Thursdays, I have a lot of control over the work that gets done.
Chris
So I think that that’s a wonderful way of approach. It so it’s not that you don’t have these things identified that you’re going to do. It’s just they’re not with strict time boundaries. Right. So you basically you’re saying not on Tuesday yet for these four hours. I’m going to work on this type of stuff. Now let’s go to the list of that type of stuff that I want to work on and start. Working my way through.
Celia
Exactly. Exactly.
Chris
So what would you say that you know now that that that you’ve experienced the benefits of of using a system like this that that you didn’t know back then?
Celia
The I would say that the first you know what I’ve experienced and feeling wise is a sense of peace. And if I am away or am out of town or something happens, all of this information exists outside of my brain, which means that it could be used by someone else. A team member could set in. So I don’t feel as much pressure on my own self as I used to. When things were either disorganized or just not systemized or yeah, disorganized or not, systemized would be the key. So definitely I there’s a feeling of peace and then also. I see a lot of people when I talk about systems. In particular, they share their mindset around, Oh my gosh, it just feels like I’m going to be boxed in and it just it feels like too restrictive for me and I don’t know if I ever felt that way. But I do know that learning how to adapt the system to my natural rhythms. Is has really been the key and to be to be curious with the process. So if I were like what we’re talking about now with my with my weekly schedule, my time plan. Thing it It’s evolving. This is a stress. This is a system that I’m creating from scratch based on my natural rhythms. So if were to talk 90 days from now, things will be slightly different and evolve from where they are now. So I would say that I’ve also learned that that don’t in, in, in this case, like if you begin with the. And in mind. Yes, think about your goal, but the. Whole system doesn’t. Have to be perfectly printed out from day one. Give yourself that space for the evolution, for it to develop.
Chris
Absolutely that that’s really the continuous improvement cycle that we really need to embrace. And one of the principles of that is we don’t try to get it perfect the first time like one of the expressions one of my mentors used to say is you don’t try to boil the ocean, right?
Celia
Yes, that’s a good one.
Chris
You do a little bit at a time and you just keep improving and improving, improving. Definitely it’s successes. When you have the opportunity to improve what you already have, it’s important not to have the thought that that it maybe you were failing before that that’s not the case. You’re obviously building and making it better and.
Celia
Right, right.
Chris
So share a success that you’ve experienced that you attribute at least in part, to having the system you have now.
Celia
Yes, so OK. So I would definitely say umm, I was, I’m in the process of right now of speaking on, I’ve spoken on three different, three different summits in the last couple of weeks. So just talking you know bringing it back to our contacts today. So seeing those goals. Become a reality. So then that’s helped my e-mail list to go. Go UM having like today. I had a podcast episode go live that I was a guest on, so just really seeing like my goals and what I’m planning. Coming to fruition. Which obviously helps me to build my reach and connect with more people that I would never meet if I weren’t doing that so. That’s a success. Another one that just happened was I’m very consistent with my emailing my list because of my systems and my planning. And I just got a client last week from an e-mail that I sent to my list and you know, so like it’s just there’s always little wins that go along the ways. Uhm, so those are so those are just a couple like of the quantitative business successes, uh, more of a personal one was went camping last weekend and I was able to take this packing list that I had made. For the sum of a big summer trip. And create it into like an ongoing checklist for every time we have this type of camping trip. I have my list ready to go, so camping we had like 100 different little items. Like, sometimes I’ll just feel like so scattered because things are everywhere from when we return to when we get ready to go again. And so that’s a success of just having, OK, here’s my plan. I just have to run through my checklist. OK, good. Everything’s gone. Ready to go? And we’re out the door. So I you know, there’s a success in, like, having more pleasure and enjoyment of preparing for our TRIPS and then also being on the TRIPS and. A sense of pride with that.
Chris
That definitely makes a big difference, and I can empathize with that because we didn’t go camping for about four years in a. Row just for different circumstances. And then the COVID thing and all that. And we decided we’re going to this year. So it was like reinventing the wheel, trying to get everything we needed in the trailer we have.
Celia
Right.
Chris
We did three trips this summer and I think by the third trip we finally got it down to an art.
Celia
Perfect. See, I’m sure that you have your systems in place for that.
Chris
So we did a bit of a debrief and uh. How can we make sure that we utilize what we figured out and not forget it between now and next year when it’s time to do it again, right?
Celia
Right, right. My husband for camping. He’s more of a paperless person and I’m like, I cannot write a new list every time we’re going camping like I know he carries a lot of stuff in his head. I’m like I need it digital and I need it like ready to go and I don’t want to have to reinvent the wheel or I feel like I’m doing something for the first time. Every time I’m doing. That, that, that’s to me, that’s a waste of energy and thought.
Chris
Yeah, definitely a great level of frustration. For me, for sure.
Celia
Right.
Chris
Already been through this? Why am I trying to figure? It out again. So let’s talk about accountability for a minute. Do you ever wake up and have a a day where you just don’t want? To touch the notion.
Celia
Oh yeah, definitely, definitely with, yeah.
Chris
How do you navigate that?
Celia
How do I navigate it? So usually it might be like I have several messages from my team that they they’re responding to. That, and I just can’t wrap my brain around it. And so usually I will just take the space away and I won’t force myself to go to go do anything with it and I’ll give myself. I’ll just kind of give myself the space to work through that for whatever has me feeling overwhelmed and then and then I’ll come back or I’ll just wait until I have like a. Kind of a productivity point where I’m like, OK, I’m ready to work. I’m reading around my brain around this, but usually I’ll just if I’m feeling that way, I’ll give myself a break and just be away from the computer altogether. So I won’t be on my phone or anything because there’s just something inside of me that just needs a break right now.
Chris
Can you share a little bit more specifics around what you’re feeling or thinking before you make that determination to give yourself the space?
Celia
Right. It’s just it’s an internal resistance. It’s uh, it’s like almost like an invisible wall is, uh, sort of like in my chest and almost around my brain too. And I just can’t really penetrate it. And I feel like if I go in, if I go beyond that, then I’ll be pushing or I could be like if I’m tired, I could over exert myself. Or I won’t do my best quality of work. And so that’s usually what I’m feeling. And then and when I feel that way and think those thoughts, I know like let me just give myself a break right now. And then sometimes I will let my team. Know like hey. You know, I’ll respond when I can. I’m just. I just need a break right now. But but I there’s a lot of fluidity with my team as well. I don’t give them, like, hard, rigid deadlines like, oh, I need this. In 24 hours. Because I’m so structured, we there’s also spaciousness for them to create for them to work on projects, and I and I usually give them due dates. You know that are in well well in. So there’s not like these hard, fast deadlines that we’re working through, and I’m just like running away from work.
Chris
So you’re able to be mindful. Notice that it the most appropriate action is something different than diving into the system and intentionally switching gears, so to speak, into something else, to look after yourself, then right self-care, self compassion totally. And I think that’s so important and. You know, I’ve I’ve seen some people try to implement certain planning systems where they become overwhelmed with it and then they say, oh, this doesn’t work. And the term that I like to use is. They’re overcooking it, right? They’re trying to make it super specific and perfect, as the author expressed it, but we’re all individuals. And we are human, so we have good days and not as good days, they’ll say different days and we need to be able to go with the flow a little bit too. It’s important to come up with that balance when. Going with the flow is OK versus falling off the wagon and maybe going in a bad direction. That’s a different sort of thing, but it’s important to be able to distinguish the two.
Celia
Yes, yes. And because I believe that having systems and structures in place prevents the shiny object and sort of like falling off the wagon or going in the bad direction. Because everything is there and usually you’re not going to sit down if you’ve put a lot of time and energy and effort into developing your system. You’re not going. To just sit down. I mean, I shouldn’t say you. I know I’m not going to just sit. Sit down one day and wipe it. Wipe it out completely, because this is my intellectual property. In some ways, this is my life’s work coming together so. So for me it’s more about the subtle tweets and because it’s all there again like kind of bring it back to what I said earlier that I’m not just like inventing well, every time I sit down, it’s all there I have. I can give myself that grace to take a break and know that it’s going to be ready and waiting for me when I when I come back. UM, and then if and then. If I do, if I do reach a point where it’s like 2 days, three days, four days, five days, that that hasn’t happened. But it you know other than like being on vacation, but like UM, having like several bad days in a row like that. That I would probably be like, OK, I need to go to a coach or a therapist. Or this is? This is something beyond what the system can help me do. Like I need some extra support here because something’s obviously going on.
Chris
So overall then, how would you say this has improved your time management effectiveness?
Celia
Oh, it’s been amazing. So I have to tell you a little story about time management. I tracked my every waking hour of my day for a little over a year. So starting last summer, I first started off with a paper system and I would share much about this, but I started out with a paper system. And I was. I was using my my phone timer and I would track. And if you have I can kind of break down how I did that, but I’ll just kind of give the high level UM, so I would track my working hours throughout the day and then eventually several months later I moved into a digital system. I started using toggle timer. And from the moment I woke up to the moment I went to bed, I would track everything I did in every waking hour and it would became much easier when I was when I digitized UM, I stopped doing that this summer. I had reached the year and I was like, I have enough data and so I used all of that information. That I gathered from doing that year, that of time study to then build out my systems, because I always knew approximately how many, how how much time things took. So like a little quick task may take 5 to 15 minutes so at this point for time management I don’t have like a hard fast time management because I know on average from that year of time study how much things, how much times things take and can can pretty much plan accordingly. So that’s my that’s my answer.
Chris
OK, so to recap, you went into an in-depth study of your own habits and studied what you’d do for an entire year, gathered that data, and used that in order to optimize your system. And would you say to be able to predict your capabilities when planning projects?
Celia
Yeah, A1. 4% and it helped me to set up high level structures inside of notion because the whole the whole point was to optimize my work time. I wanted to. I wanted to work a certain number of hours per. Week and it. All started because I actually didn’t know how many hours I was working per week. My whole creative blow approach had no had no structure around it and I never knew how how much time a project would take. I never knew how much out how. Many hours I. Was working per week, it was affecting my marriage. Edge, like us being able to go do fun things because I just always felt guilty like I had any working, working, working. So that’s how the time study evolved. I called it my human experiment and. And so in that when I was when I was tracking in psychology, there is a there’s it’s a phenomenon called the Observer effect and it’s. And it it’s essentially if we feel like somebody. Is watching us. We perform differently than if somebody were. And so having that timer going and having that clock going brought in the observer effect of me always being aware of what I was doing and how much time things were taking. And so then that informed me to start creating those repeatable processes of just things that people were asking me for on repeat. And so I started to build systems. Around the trends and the patterns that I was seeing, so I could optimize. Nice things. So if it the first time it took 5 or 10 minutes to do something, maybe it became a 62nd task after it was systemized.
Chris
Wow, that’s incredibly brilliant. I love it.
Celia
Thank you. Yes, it really helped me to collapse time so that I could. That’s why I always like to say like earn more while working less because then it’s like everything is mapped out. It’s there, it’s optimized, it’s organized, and then I can just do the thing because a lot of a lot of times, like things don’t take as long as people think that they do. It’s our head and it’s our. Thoughts that actually take up the most time it’s like. The click and do the work doesn’t take that long. So now I do track my working hours only. I will say that so when when I go to work, I do clock the work hours per week. I did want to add that.
Chris
And why do you talk that?
Celia
So because I I have my my work goal like we talked about like. I set this. I said this weekly schedule outline. This is my plan for the week of how I’m going to structure my time and then I want to have that documentation and this is how this is what I did this week. Umm, so it’s definitely for accountability. And also just to see kind of where my focus is going because at the end of the week toggle will send me like a report. And I can see. OK, this week I spent, you know, 8 hours training or I spent this, this, this many hours doing this. And so it just helps me. Do I spend this much time selling or whatever? It just helps me to kind of keep. A high level. Overview of of how many hours I’m working. Uhm, so it’s essentially like I’m clocking in and out for my company.
Chris
Really, you’re really into the data. That’s great.
Celia
But yeah, yeah, that’s so pretty. And it’s so funny because I don’t really consider myself to be like a Dada Dada person, but I I am.
Chris
Well, you can’t improve what you don’t measure, right?
Celia
That’s true. That’s true.
Chris
So you’re measuring. You’re getting that data and you can. Really, you know, benefit.
Celia
That it is. Yeah. I think so. And I think that that’s an area of improvement for me with with like all that I’ve built inside of my notion and all that I have is starting to really like set like K PI’s and more of the tracking and the measurements. I think that that that’s I know that that’s the next level kind of system and. And tool for me to implement and what I’m doing so I can get more measurement because right now it’s more like I have the visuals and I have the goal. UM, but there there’s like a a next level for me for sure being being transparent.
Chris
So then in the spirit of continuous improvement, what’s one thing that’s bugging you about how your system works now that you’re noodling on making better? Maybe not quite sure how to do it, but what aspect of it are you looking? To improve, well, I’m.
Celia
Constantly adding things and so for me. It’s that it doesn’t get chaotic. Uh, because there’s sort there’s like sort of like the ebb and flow where, like, things are really structured. And then I add a bunch of stuff and then I need to go do a clean up. So like right now I’m at a phase. Where I’m getting ready to need to go do a clean. Up especially and my like my training and learning area because I’m a I’m a lifelong learner and so I create pages for like the different programs that I’m in and I hold myself accountable to like follow through on things that I invest in. So then I’ll have little notes and then I’ll create little. Extra pages and things like that, so really keeping things streamlined and not falling into like the silo trap I would say is is something that I’m always kind of managing and something that I’m. I I need kind of need to do an audit and just see like where things might be getting a little disorganized. UM and do a cleanup.
Chris
Auditing auditing yourself.
Celia
Yeah, yes, yeah. I ordered. I ordered things for clients all the time and just coming through and doing a self audit. And just like kind of listening. Like you like. I don’t remember exactly how you phrased the question, but to me it’s like you know, what is that? Annoyance or what? Is that thought that keeps coming up over and over again and really looking at that pattern? And saying, OK, I’m gonna go into my notion now and like really address what is bothering me about this.
Chris
So everybody experiences setbacks in their life from time to time, and I’m wondering how has having your systems in place helped you navigate a set back?
Celia
So this year I. Decided to make a change with I. Basically I let my biggest client go several months ago and it was a big leap but. Because of all of my analysis and information, I knew that I could actually make more income, letting that client go, even though, like logically it didn’t make sense. And so while it was. Is like a technically could be a set back like my income dropped down because I had all my systems and processes in place. I was able to keep going and keep moving forward and not get freaked out or let that turn into like. A you know, like devastating moment or anything like that.
Chris
I think that’s a great. Essentially it just highlights that you’re prepared and you have the information to make a good decision.
Celia
Right, right from all the time tracking from everything and even I think that I stayed. Like a little. Too long with the client because I was like, oh, the money. You know, in in kind of the security of of the you know, because I was on a retainer with them. But at the same time when I started to see what it was costing me in my livelihood. Maybe even the set back happened before that in terms of like, I was starting to feel really defeated. My whole point of setting things up the way I have is to create calm and stability and just like. To not be in fight or flight. So in going deeper into the story, I realized that the step back was probably staying with the client too long and starting to actually get into like a stress response, physically and mentally in my body. Really, you know what came to mind too, that I wanted to share was just a little back story, was that this whole thing evolved with the time tracking I shared about, like, the time tracking, but then also I got really burned out last summer because during the pandemic I was. I was running, I was training and leading sales teams for virtual events and working like really long hours on zoom all the time and really hadn’t had a break from like April of of 2020 through maybe June of 2021. I mean, I just been going and going and going and I had maybe I had done like 13 or 14 events at that time when. Those were sometimes 16 hour days on zoom. Uh for for four days sprints and so I hit a burnout point where I was just exhausted for weeks and I didn’t want to do anything and I didn’t have my systems in place for anybody to help me move things forward while I was, like really tired. So I just, I realized. Well, having everything in my brain was was forcing me to kind of really to be limited and not really have a business. You know? Uhm, so. So that was part of the catalyst along with the time tracking exercise. And just to to completely make a shift because of that final burnout, because everything was so like driven by me and in my mind, in my head, I needed to make a change. So that is my, that was my set back.
Chris
Thank you for sharing that. So here’s a question that might be shocking for you. Imagine that your your notion system completely disappears. What is your life like now?
Celia
Probably what I would do is a big brain dump first thing is brain. Like what I can remember in terms of what are the repeat tasks, all of that and get as much as I can out of my brain and onto paper and then probably have someone research for me like what are we going to use next? What are we going to do next to to get moved into a new system so? I think it would be. I think it would pick up and. And be OK, like within a couple weeks, I’d probably cry and have, like, a freak out. And like I’d not be happy. For a little bit and then just and then just move right along and pick up with the next thing.
Chris
I find this a A really interesting reflection exercise because you know in people’s journeys they’ve gone from not having that stuff to having it and then not necessarily being mindful about what life must have been like back then. Compared to now, right?
Celia
Right.
Chris
And maybe it didn’t seem as chaotic then, but maybe you weren’t exercising near as much capability as you are now and influence and? The effect on the world, right?
Celia
Right, right. And I think that like what how I’ve developed into what I have now like, those are lifelong skills that I can take with me, right? Like I like, I’m able to have these high level conversations like what we’re having today based on all of that experience that I know that I would be able to go in. I mean that would be kind of like a. Have fun like an exercise like, hey, we’re gonna just start from scratch today. Like, what would you do? Like, almost like a similar. Nation emergency preparedness and simulation. So that’s a good question.
Chris
OK, so Celia, tell us about your business and the services you offer. How would you like people to contact you and find out more? And I guess specifically to who should be contacting you?
Celia
Yes, yes. So I work with UM, I work with the business owner. And so generally my my business owners are at the multiple 6 into 7 figure mark in their businesses and they have a team. Team I work with some UM solar previewers that are right at the six figures. Uh, but usually I’m I work best with somebody that at least has like one person that they’re delegating to and has, you know, that they’re scaling their business. And umm what I do with them is I audit their business in terms. Of like their personal productivity, uh, how many hours a week that they’re working? I look at their sales process and like the whole customer journey that their prospective customers go through and see how documented and optimized that is. So that they could either bring on a sales team member or just create more ease relieving that pressure off of them of doing the job and then also look at their offers in terms of like what is the customer experience from like once they come into the offer. So I would say it’s a little bit more operations and strategy focus. With a focus on sales conversion as as well. And I’ve just found that working with people that are a little further along income wise. They already have things in place that are working, and then we’re coming in to optimize versus somebody who’s like a brand new entrepreneur. They’re they’re just trying to figure things out. And so I do better when things are already established and we can optimize and improve. And then, of course, if they want to create something new, we can kind of use what’s already working. To, you know, create a new offer, for example, so you can connect with me on LinkedIn. My name is Celia Themeisle, my website is multifacetedresults.com.
Chris
Obviously a potential. Client doesn’t know what you know, so how would they know that they should be contacting? What would they be experiencing right now that hey, call Celia.
Celia
Number one, burnout feeling some level of burnout and stress in their business, not feeling creative at all and knowing that you being creative and excited about your business is definitely a key to like being productive and you know, loving what you do because especially in coaching, your clients pick up on that. They’re working in, you know, with those relationships. So the burnout, uh, frustrated with your team? Uh, projects aren’t moving along like you would you feel like you’re even kind of wasting money. You’re hiring contractors that aren’t generally like helping you to. Fulfill your goals. You’re not closing as many deals as you think you should. You think you have this great. Offer and you your conversion rate isn’t where you would like it to be. Those are some of the top. Level UM, self diagnosis, things that they could definitely look at and then and reach out to me because I can I can support with all of those things.
Chris
Well, thank you so much, Celia, for joining us and sharing your journey. Maybe we can touch base again in the future and hear how your journey is going because and it sounds like it’s evolving as it goes.
Celia
I would love that. It is. Thank you so much for inviting me, Chris. And this has just been awesome and I just love your questions and really diving into all of the nuances and how you created some processes and structures for the listeners to think through. As I was sharing, we are minds work alike. Thank you.
Chris
Take care.